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NIGHTSHADEISIS's Photo NIGHTSHADEISIS Posts: 1,120
1/11/11 10:02 P

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See, that's why I like the balance that TKD and CHKD give me.

TKD is flat out a direct and offensive style. Power, speed, high kicks, and while there is an emphasis on blocking, there isn't as much. It works in both long and short range attacks, but on the aggressive side.

CHKD is just the opposite; purely defensive. Joint locks and manipulations, rolls, throws, breakfalls, etc. What to do in the event of every conceivable hold: side choke, full front/rear choke, hair grab, wrist, lapel, belt, bear hug, full/half nelson...the list goes on. That style is about momentum and using opposing energies to your advantage.



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-Doctor Who, the 12th Doctor, "A Christmas Carol."


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JOES_DAD Posts: 20
4/18/10 10:45 P

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I couldn't agree more. In particular I like your remark about practicing full or semi contact. I have found it very helpful to fight martial artists from diffrent backgrounds. Early on in my training, I used to seekout people to spar with from every school in the area. It was very helpful.

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ECORDAL Posts: 2
4/18/10 3:12 P

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Yes, a find both WT and JKD really great as they involve fighting from an inclose distance most people arenīt familiar with, as most people are long range or grappling oriented. This knowledge about inclose fighting could give the WT or JKD practitioner an edge.
Nevertheless, my point is a little more general than a comparison among martial arts.
In an all out dirty street confrontation is my believe and my experience:
1) Once you let a dangerous person in your "territory", if he attacks you, most of the time you will not be able to defend yourself. As the person crosses the line (punch distance)you should attack first. That is because the reaction time concept (your brain recognizes the attack + sends a message to your body + you execute the defense)that keeps you one step behind if you are on a defensive mood.
2) You have to avoid by all means a long distance interchange of blows. So, after your first strike, you follow immediately with a chain of fast attacks (mostly punches, knees and elbows).
3) Your aim in street fight is to finish it in seconds (no much more than 5 or 6). This also applies if you find your self in a grappling scenario or went undesirably to the ground. Thatīs why antigrappling and ground fighting for the streets are particularly nasty and not pretty at all.
I find a wild, furious and aggressive offense more important than technique. You have to rely on gross motor skills and, at the same time, you have to know where to hit (or gouge) to cause the greater damage.
Finally I could not agree more with you than besides all you have to avoid getting paralyzed (because youīve been hit or because you are doubtful about launching your attack). Thatīs why you have to add two elements to your training:
1) Training under stress (military-like training)
2) Some form of full or semi contact (kick boxig or muay thay are great, with the appropriate safety equipment to avoid real damage)
Keep up your training and good luck everybody!!!


JOES_DAD Posts: 20
4/17/10 1:43 P

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Ecordal, For the most part I agree with you (as you will see below). When you mention distance however that is only true of some styles. Wing Chun and to a lesser degree Jeet Kune Do practioners train as infighters. They feel most comfortable in close range and they develop both skill and psychological comfort in close range fighting. They spend much of their time practcing getting into this range. Part of the reason for this is that most other styles are more comfortable at a longer range and the closeness gains the infighter both a skill and psychological advantage. A wing chun fighter is very comfortable fighting in an area as tight as a phone booth, while many kicking and sports styles are at a disadvantage fighting in an area as large as an elevator.

The closeness and agression of the infighter are both part of the physical and psychological shock you mention. In Wing Chun every defense has a simultaneous attack or is both an attack and a defense.

So with styles like Wing Chun defenses are prefered at close range as are attacks - which are either at the same time or the same motion. I suggst that if you have to pick which one (attack or defense) and can't do both - then it comes down to if you have trained to take a hit.

I also suggest everyone who trains to fight learn early on if they can take a hit, because if you can't you should avoid fighting at all cost.

Training for an aggressive offense or even 'wild aggressivness' in many cases will win the fight. This is even more true if you can take a hit. Being purely defense however will never win.

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ECORDAL Posts: 2
4/16/10 7:12 P

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In a real confrontation on the street itīs all about awareness and distance. In Krav Maga when we are forced to use defensive moves from close distance we believe that something went wrong. You should learn to strike while defending and, when caught off guard, always counter simultaneously with your defense.
A real confrontation is as much psychological as physical and your goal should be always to shock your aggressor by letting clear in his mind that the aggressor suddenly are YOU. Bear in mind that once you are hit or assaulted you have only a very few seconds to react before you are shocked yourself and out, with unknown consequences.
To sum up I think itīs not that much about which martial art you chose, but the mind frame with which you train and the search for a condition that allows you to deploy wild aggressiviness at will when needed, which can indeed be learned through proper training
Sorry for my poor English
Good luck!

JOES_DAD Posts: 20
4/11/10 4:16 A

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I would suggest Wing Chun. I have found it helps me balance my Kenpo. Boxing is primarly a sport and honestly any good Kenpo practioner can pretty much figure out it's weakness outside the ring. I don't say this to slam boxing, which is great, but they have no need to protect their lower gates in that sport. Boxing is however better for weight loss than Wing Chun. Wing Chun has too much economy of motion for that purpose.

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TEUFELHUNDEN's Photo TEUFELHUNDEN SparkPoints: (0)
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3/21/10 3:24 P

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Personally I believe your Kenpo stances would be much stronger and offensive than the standard boxing stances. I did notice you mentioned "Boxing Hardcore Bootcamp" which I interpret as no time in the ring boxing. Boxing stance is your hip pointing at your opponent, forearms protecting your rib cage and hands protecting your head no need to worry about the waist down.
Kenpo primarily defensive art? Sure they teach you how to stay away from a bad situation, how to talk your way out, but then after that first evasive move or preemptive strike they teach you to use every part of your body as a weapon using multiple strikes and using your environment as a weapon as well. Roll it up all together kick, punch, head but, grapple, etc... It's a lot more aggressive than defensive!
For power, your sensei I'm sure will agree, starts from the earth. Fighting arts to sports it all starts with a good base or stance. I agree partially with mrwilla2006 and physics/kinesiology but start from the earth up.
In short if it's fun then keep doing it don't make it complicated!!. That way you keep going back!!!

For dwelling, the Earth is good.
For the mind, depth is good.
The goodness of giving is in the timing.
The goodness of speech is in honesty.
MRWILLIA2006's Photo MRWILLIA2006 SparkPoints: (0)
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2/16/10 1:48 P

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I boxed from the age of 6 and still do from time to time. I have taken many different art forms, and the more you can take the better. I like the mixture of boxing, American Kenpo, Limalama, and Kosho Ryu jujitsu. Just remember it’s all in the "HIPS". Think about the physics/kinesiology of the movement, the power comes from the hips. For example think about how a batter swings a bat, how the motions are affected has he or she steps, shifts and rotates his or her hips and staying loose through the movement until the power or energy is moved through the hands etc... I know short version but I think you get the idea, and to answer the topic question on offense vs. defense I’m Passive aggressive!

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COUGAR67's Photo COUGAR67 Posts: 1,946
2/13/10 6:36 P

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Am just starting my life of martial arts journey. Look forward to learning the difference between the martial arts styles. Saying that I enjoy the art of Tea Kwon Do because of the balance of using both a offensive and defensive moves if the same motion. Always ready for the next movement. But as I said I only know the one style.

EST. Michigan, USA


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MIMERKI's Photo MIMERKI SparkPoints: (0)
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2/12/10 10:33 P

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Different but similar: I practice mainly a hard style of karate and sometimes attend classes for soft martial arts (aikido being the most obvious). I end up feeling like I'm doing something closer to ballroom dance in the soft styles, but when I get back to karate it really does make me a better karate-ka.

Read and read and read this Book of Five Rings, and step and step and step on this dojo floor.


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KENPO_GIRL's Photo KENPO_GIRL Posts: 387
2/12/10 9:44 P

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Ok, as of 4 weeks ago, I earned my green belt in Shaolin Kenpo after 2.5 years of training. That was not a boast, but for illustration purpose. My art is primarily a defensive (with many joint locks, breaks, and lots of other pretty mean stuff meant to cripple an attacker) art form. I have been at this for a little bit now, and I am so used to being defensive, that I am having a hard time with offensive technique such as in boxing.

I've been losing weight and exercising a lot, and I go to this really awesome "boxing night" at hardcore bootcamp. It is about a 90 workout between the bodyweight exercises (jumping jacks, pushups, crunches, shadow-boxing drills, etc) and the punching bag and mitt routines. Anyway, when I do the mitts, the instructor is constantly telling me to get lower, to sink my tooshie down lower in order to get more power behind my punches. I find that taking on a more offensive stance is proving to be very challenging after 2+ years of always training on the defensive. Pardon the pun, but boxing is a whole new ball game! But it sure is fun and I can definitely see where these skills could enhance my Kenpo skills. Anyone else everyone experience this sort of thing?

Play Hard or Don't Play At All! ~me

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"When you think you can't go on any longer, DON'T QUIT! Just keep going for 30 more seconds, after-all, you can do anything for 30 seconds!" ~Sensei Justin Terrien



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