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4EVRYOUNG Posts: 5,174
12/4/13 5:45 P

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Myrea, we get it. You believe the only reason they were questioned and detained was their race. In this case the "evidence"(further detailed by many other sites) support the police' action regardless of the color of their skin.

Unless there is some "evidence" we haven't seen I prefer to judge by the evidence I have seen.

I don't think Penny, Bridie or I have ever indicated that we aren't sympathetic to the fact that racial profiling is wrong and that it goes on in Texas or in every other state in the country. I don't consider my opinion as being racially biased.

Val

"If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got!
MYREALANA's Photo MYREALANA SparkPoints: (0)
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12/4/13 5:34 P

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Right. I'm totally sure everything would have gone down exactly the same way if the two men had been white or if the girl has been black.

And I've got a bridge for sale - CHEAP!

--Myrea

"If you can't do something smart, do something right." --
Shepherd Book


4EVRYOUNG Posts: 5,174
12/4/13 5:19 P

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I agree Penny. I have to know a great deal about the adults and I know I wouldn't allow my child to travel alone with two men.

My youngest(white) son was racially profiled when he attended the rodeo with a black family. They didn't believe he was with them until they showed their tickets. Tickets which had our name printed on them.

By the way the father is 6'-5" Harris County Constable. The mom ripped the attendant a new "a$$h*le.

We all got a good laugh afterwards.

Trivial? Yes. But still racial profiling...in reverse!



Val

"If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got!
BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
12/4/13 4:26 P

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Just an FYI..I don't play with toys and I haven't gone anywhere. The thing that won't happen again is the sharing of personal anecdotes here regarding family reactions to issues that personally affected only my bi racial family. I am and probably shall remain a person who can often see both sides of a question and do not apologize for that. It's OK not to share or even understand a viewpoint I put forth. Mutual respect is nice, 'tho.

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COACHPENNY's Photo COACHPENNY Posts: 10,392
12/4/13 4:08 P

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I think the girl's parents were off base for letting their 13 year old travel out of state with two young men...regardless of race. Have they ever heard of hormones. Did the parents question sleeping arrangements? Sleeping in a gas station parking doesn't show great judgement at best. Maybe the mom is just beginning to realize how she is being judged as a parent in this scenario.



“A word to the wise ain't necessary, it's the stupid ones who need the advice.”

Bill Cosby


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4EVRYOUNG Posts: 5,174
12/4/13 3:58 P

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The girl and the two men were found sleeping in the car in a gas station parking lot at 3 in the morning.

Did racism play into it? Only the police know if they were profiling. Handcuffs may have been over-kill. Have you ever thought that a 13 yr old girl being faced with the possibility that she would be kept from experiencing her "life-long" dream might have acted emotionally to herself and her friends being questioned by the officers? Is it possible that she said or acted in a way that the police might feel she, themselves and the two men being questioned would be safer if she was also handcuffed?

Should the officers have just said, "Hey you have this paper giving you custody of this 13 yr old girl" across state lines not have questioned it's authenticity?

I too have signed a similar document in case my child was hurt while in another's possession but I too would have question those people with my child sleeping in a parking lot at 3 in the morning. A responsible guardian should also understand appreciate the officers doing their job.

The mother has since said that she appreciated the officers diligence but questioned the use of cuffs.

Val

"If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got!
COACHPENNY's Photo COACHPENNY Posts: 10,392
12/4/13 2:50 P

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"I honestly can't believe that reasonable Americans can sit there are say that racial profiling is OK in America in 2013 - because bad things sometimes happen."

Since none of us said that Myrea, it's hard to ascertain how you formed that opinion.

If my 13 year old daughter were in a car with out of state plates, with two young men...black white or any other color of the rainbow and the police suspected illicit activity....you better believe that I would expect them to act.

That the police may have had an additional motive is not something we have defended or excused. A real issue of concern is that the police would not act to investigate suspicious behavior because they might be accused of racial profiling.

I'm not sure what point you are trying to prove, Myrea. It's lost on me.




“A word to the wise ain't necessary, it's the stupid ones who need the advice.”

Bill Cosby


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MYREALANA's Photo MYREALANA SparkPoints: (0)
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12/4/13 12:51 P

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I am aghast.

I honestly can't believe that reasonable Americans can sit there are say that racial profiling is OK in America in 2013 - because bad things sometimes happen.

That it's OK for police to handcuff and detain a 13-year-old girl when they have a notarized letter, her original birth certificate, health insurance card and contact information for her mother and father AND continue to hold her after they've spoken to the mother.

I honestly don't even know what to say.

--Myrea

"If you can't do something smart, do something right." --
Shepherd Book


COACHPENNY's Photo COACHPENNY Posts: 10,392
12/4/13 12:28 P

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I agree completely with Bridie and Val concerning the issue of the risk that the young girl may have been in a bad situation. This situation definitely needed to be investigated. Most likely, there is much more to this story than stated in this preliminary report. It may be that the young men were profiled, it also may be that the girl was profiled. The police may have thought she was a prostitute, she may have acted out with 13 year old indignation, the young men may or may not have acted in a way that drew attention...who knows...we weren't there. BTW the girl looks older than 13 and the young men look barely older than she appears. So much here changes perceptions.

I do know that one child's life is worth more than the temporary injustice that might have been served on the two young men. Obviously, they were detained and released. An apology would be okay, maybe the reaction could have been more respectful, but to say the police should not have detained and investigated something suspicious to them is wrong on many levels.

There have been numerous incidents of gymnastics, swimming and dance, etc. coaches/instructors that have taken predatory advantage of students. So the words of the young people involved and even the notarized letter were not enough to assume nothing untoward was in progress.



“A word to the wise ain't necessary, it's the stupid ones who need the advice.”

Bill Cosby


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MYREALANA's Photo MYREALANA SparkPoints: (0)
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12/4/13 11:02 A

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You're the one who said you felt the same way, once she explained it to you, Bridie. I didn't put any words in your mouth.

I believe precisely the opposite. If bad guys get away because we respect the rights of honest citizens and do not detain or harass them needlessly, so be it.

What was done to your daughter-in-law is appalling and should never have happened - no matter how many potential terrorists it might eventually catch.

I'm sorry if that opinion offends you, and if you are so harmed by my disagreement, the by all means, take your toys and go home. I didn't realize that I'm not supposed to share my reaction to you stories. It doesn't say that in the rule anywhere that I can see.

Edited by: MYREALANA at: 12/4/2013 (11:28)
--Myrea

"If you can't do something smart, do something right." --
Shepherd Book


BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
12/4/13 9:40 A

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Racism is not OK... nor is bigotry. It has never been OK with me. Less so now if that is possible, since it's become more personally applicable. I'm sorry that's all you took from my relating a family incident ..as I said, this was my DIL's opinion..I was furious, but since she was (and is) the one who has been the target of racial profiling and I have not, and is the one raising our beloved grandchildren, who I am sure will be, am I to consider her response total BS? I tneed to respect her experience, and thought it was interesting so I shared it.. Won't happen again.

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MYREALANA's Photo MYREALANA SparkPoints: (0)
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12/4/13 9:10 A

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So, racism is OK - so long as it occasionally catches a bad guy?

I could not disagree more.

--Myrea

"If you can't do something smart, do something right." --
Shepherd Book


BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
12/4/13 8:34 A

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No need to handcuff anyone..ITA with that..sorry, but I work with women's groups that fight sex trafficking so my first thought would not be to take anyone's word for anything. You would not believe what's going on out there..or maybe you would. If the mother's note was legally notarized, and they had checked on the notary after they accosted the group, they should have said "have a nice day", waved goodbye to the group and let that be that. I'll have to read more on this case..interesting and disturbing.
.I do not like racial profiling..I am the woman who's DIL was racially profiled by the TSA when boarding a flight to another country, and investigated for hours regarding the parentage of the infant she had with her ..because she is brown, and our grandson was not. She missed her flight, faced interrogation, attempted intimidation, and was kept separate from her breastfed baby for long enough to become very uncomfortable, etc. To say I was furious is an understatement. My DIL's response? "Mom, I would rather be inconvenienced for a couple hours unnecessarily and erroneously than have even one child taken out of the country by a stranger who means harm." . I felt kind of the same way once she put it that way.

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12/4/13 8:26 A

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You are absolutely right about this Myrea.Do I smell the Klan here?

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MYREALANA's Photo MYREALANA SparkPoints: (0)
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12/4/13 8:24 A

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You cannot honestly think this would have happened had the men been White, can you?

When my son went to California with his grandparents this summer, I had exactly the same kind of letter notarized for his care. His last name is different from my parents', so I wanted to make sure that they had the legal right to make any necessary decisions for him on the trip. I was in London, England at the time, and difficult to reach.

No, I would not he happy with "better safe than sorry" treatment by California Social Services if they had taken my child from his legal guardians, placed him in handcuffs and insisted that he stay at a foster home in California until I could make arrangements to fly half way around the world to free him.

Luckily, my parents are white, so them having a cute little white kid in their care is perfectly OK.

--Myrea

"If you can't do something smart, do something right." --
Shepherd Book


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12/4/13 8:18 A

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Handcuffing a 13-year-old girl.
Taking her away from her legal guardians without a single shred of evidence except she's white and they're black.
Refusing to examine the legal documentation the guardians have showing their right to care for the girl.
Placing the girl in CPS care and insisting that her mother travel to Houston to get her out, in spite of the legal notarized letter saying she has given this man care of her daughter for the trip because "we do things differently in Texas."

Yeah, it's all perfectly "reasonable" - assuming DWB is a real offense - especially with a pretty white girl in the car.

It is not "better safe than sorry." Civil rights apply even to situations that don't make us feel all warm and fuzzy inside. They had no apparent good reason to even question the group, but even if they had, the moment where they handcuffed a 13-year-old child, confined her in the back of a police car and then turned her over to social services IN SPITE OF the legal evidence and matching stories of everyone in the car AND the phone call from her mother, those cops proved that the #1 offense in their town is a white girl being with a black man. Period.


--Myrea

"If you can't do something smart, do something right." --
Shepherd Book


BRIDIE5 Posts: 8,121
12/3/13 6:40 P

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With what's been happening to young girls in the USA and all over the world re sex trafficking, I'm in agreement with Val..Had it been a young girl that age with two adult males regardless of color who were obviously not her parent it's mandatory to remove the kid to safe neutral ground while investigating their right to transport her. Dunno if that's what motivated the Texas cops..but whatever, better safe than sorry. Bad things happen to kids and women in this world, on a daily basis.

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4EVRYOUNG Posts: 5,174
12/3/13 5:23 P

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Let's say your 13 yr old daughter was found sleeping in a car with 2 men in the parking lot of a gas station. The gas station did the responsible thing by notifying the police of what they may have thought were vagrants.

The child appeared to be with someone other than her parents. It was appropriate of the police to question the men as to their relationship to the girl. Should an easily acquired, signed, notarized paper be sufficient for the police to let them drive off? As her parent wouldn't you expect the police to question it's validity regardless the color of the adults?

It was Thanksgiving weekend. The police wanted to validate the document and verify everyone was who they said they were and in the meantime it is law that CPS take custody of the juvenile until it's determined whether or not their story was true. All of this took a great deal of time to sort thru.

Should the department apologize? Yes. But as a parent I would expect diligence on the part of the authorities.

I'm not saying that Texas doesn't have it's problems but there's not a state in the Union that doesn't.

Val

"If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got!
CD833620 Posts: 42,077
12/3/13 5:05 P

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Yeah Myrea, good post. definitely two black people and a white kid must mean something is wrong... And we are living when? Oh! it is 2013!!!!!

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12/3/13 11:07 A

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www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/12/02/texas
-c
ops-handcuff-and-take-13-year-old-whR>ite-girl-from-black-guardians/


Texas cops handcuff and take 13-year-old white girl from black guardians

Houston Police have refused to explain why they took a 13-year-old white girl from her two black guardians over the weekend and placed her in the custody of Child Protective Services.

Landry Thompson’s mother had signed notarized papers giving dance instructor Emmanuel Hurd full guardianship over her during a trip from Oklahoma to Houston for training, according to KHOU.

Thompson, Hurd and another dance instructor had stopped at a gas station in Houston on Saturday night when they were surrounded by police cars.

--------
Two young black men and a white girl in a car = someone's getting arrested.

Sounds like something right out of the 1950s. Which, of course, is where Texas would like to be - where only white straight men had rights and everyone else was a second class citizen or lower.

--Myrea

"If you can't do something smart, do something right." --
Shepherd Book


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